This is part of an interview (found here https://www.bitchute.com/vide/btuJXs0glmla/) with Regis Tremblay interviewing virologist Poornima Wagh (I don’t know either of them and is the first time I’ve listened to the show). I was captivated by the explanation of how to isolate a virus and then for this virologist to say there is no virus (and her lab being raided by the FBI for such ‘outlandish’ claims) is not new, but still shocking.
Even if we assume the virus is real, the draconian measures to combat it are surreal. And while the proven absence of a virus would be counterindicative for measures instantly, I fear in our current situation the presence or absence of a virus is rather irrelevant.
Far from irrelevant, it is VITAL that we dispense with Virology because without it all the draconian measures collapse as the bogus control mechanisms that they really are!
Although I can't deny some sarcasm, it was not meant as a sneer in your direction. I genuinely admire your direction of thought, it's something I have long since fail to muster. I guess I have lost the belief that we are going to resolve all this as gentlemen and -women a long time ago.
My point is, you and Frances may very well be right. But that in itself will not be enough. Because "they" have to acknowledge you being right, and they won't do that. Because it's not about the facts, it's about the agenda.
They call the sky green, you call the sky blue. Suppose you can prove the sky is blue, it will bring you nothing if they're still calling it green. They will have to call it blue, because you've proven it, you say? No they don't. And they won't either. So much of what they said about Covid turned out to be blatantly and demonstrably false, but it didn't make one iota of a difference in the end.
So my conclusion is, I admire you for searching out the "Truth", and please do not stop trying. But if you're talking to a brick wall of propaganda, it won't change anything. You can be right, but they have to give your "being right" to you as well.
Jul 30, 2022·edited Jul 31, 2022Liked by Winston Smith
I personally think this is an astroturfed distraction from stopping totalitarianism and democide and is being used to discredit the Resistance via guilt by association with those perceived to be flat-earthers. That’s not to say there isn’t merit to certain aspects of their arguments (obviously, environmental toxins have had a negative impact on health, but that doesn’t mean germs, viruses, and contagion don’t exist). Some of the virus-deniers are reasonable and willing to agree-to-disagree on this topic, but unfortunately, there is a virulent contingency of particularly hateful and aggressive individuals who are focusing their efforts on attacking the most effective voices in the anti-tyranny movement, and it is creating division at a time when it is far more important for us to unite across superficial differences and academic disagreements.
This article by A Midwestern Doctor offers a deep dive if you have the time (I don’t but have saved it for later reading):
Yes, please :-) But I only have so much bandwidth so have to stay focused on defeating totalitarianism and democide, so once that's achieved, I'd be happy to delve further into this topic.
You have been given plenty of evidence that totalitarianism depends on us continuing to believe fake science. Yet you insist that you don't have time to look..... for months you have been saying this. I call you on it.
I don’t support insult-throwing on either side and feel like this is hurling water balloons at each other while the prison gates are being installed around us. If we fight amongst ourselves, the tyrants win.
“Astroturfed distraction” sounds insulting, as does “virus denier,” a term probably chosen in the Deep State’s psywar labs to sound like “Holocaust denier.”
I do apologize for the use of those terms, Sanjoy, and I mean no disrespect to you or the other reasonable individuals on your side of the debate. Understand that it comes from having been aggressively attacked and threatened on a variety of platforms by the fundamentalist fringe of this contingency, and it is they who are doing the greatest damage to your arguments as well as to the overall resistance. I have no problems with respectful dialogue on this matter but simply ask that those of us who are focusing every ounce of our strength on defeating tyranny and ending democide be permitted to continue doing so without being subjected to ankle-biting on a matter that can be better discussed calmly after the conflagration is extinguished.
Thank you, apology accepted. I am not in favor of ankle biting. But postponing even calm discussions of these questions is a step too far, as I don’t see how the conflagration can be extinguished without taking away the lighter fluid of deadly viruses on the march.
Jul 30, 2022·edited Jul 30, 2022Liked by Winston Smith
With all due respect, my 1st introduction to terrain theory came bundled with an insult, followed by apparent stalking.
I have never disputed the merits of terrain theory. I have, however, benefitted from antibiotics, both externally on infected cuts and internally when my dentist saved my life.
They are not mutually exclusive theories, although each, in and of itself, is incomplete & likely contains errors.
Beyond that, I'm sick to death the sideshow & agree with MAA above.
Antibiotics deal to bacteria rather than viruses. I'm not exactly sure how they do that and figure that might be an interesting diversion at some stage. The picture in Winston's post looks like bacteria to me. But then it looks kind of fake as well with all those colours.
Antibiotics target various metabolic pathways of bacteria. Eg, penicillin class targets the peptidoglycan layer of the cell wall, preventing repair/replacement.
The colors are likely added or highlighted
to differentiate structures, materials, etc. Since viruses don't have their own metabolism, antobiotics aren't effective against them.
Viruses are much smaller than bacteria. Eg, the tb mycobacterium is some 500X the size of the sarscov virion.
I don't believe in viruses and the main reason is the outrageous claims that I saw made on germs in the 'Spanish flu" "outbreak" of 1918 and 1919 (and sometimes these germs were described as bacterium). It gave me the clarity to realize that we once again were being subjected to complete bollocks. Stefan Lanka also helped. As did old 1950s books on the topic. I guess others went through a similar process. The anti-vaxxers (it's a derogatory term of course) seem to have been right all along. That our governments can be so malicious towards their citizens a wake up call for those of us born after WW2 in the West.
So my view is that the so called viruses which as you say above, more or less, are completely dead are just such things as exosomes or maybe just discarded cell material. None, as we all know by now, have been isolated. The process for finding them is both physically destructive and digitally manipulative of late (i.e. they exist only on a computer).
If we bring down Virology all the mess collapses. Everything hinges on us achieving the end of bogus Rockefeller allopathy. We should unite over THAT, Margaret, rather than pussy-foot around the peripherals.
Jul 30, 2022·edited Jul 30, 2022Liked by Winston Smith
I’m all for taking down Rockefeller allopathy and have touched on that in previous articles, but that is a longer-term goal that cannot be achieved if we are frog-marched into a digital biosurveillance prison. This is why I’ve said that it is more important to stop totalitiarianism than even democide—once the digital handcuffs are on, there will be no escape and no opportunity to address the other issues.
We need the public to awaken in a massive way, and you are not going to get the middle 40% swing thinkers to look twice with this approach as it contradicts everything in their empirical and epistemological knowledge base. I have a few thousand questions that cannot be answered in a paradigm without contagion, food-borne illnesses, viral outbreaks throughout history, the microbiome/gut bacteria, the hygiene hypothesis, immune systems, autoimmune diseases, and the like, and I am already working 20-hour days and am desperately behind on what I am already committed to and cannot waste months if not years going down a rabbit-hole that looks like a dead end to start with.
I understand you are far further down that rabbit-hole and feel it has merit, so great. You are far better-equipped to address these issues than I am. There are people I respect who hold different beliefs on this matter, and I fully support their efforts to expose lies and corruption.
Associating me with 'rabbit holes' and stating that there are people you respect tells me your opinion about me and my in-depth research. If you were to read just one book, The Invisible Rainbow by Arthur Firstenberg, the 'few thousand questions that cannot be answered in a paradigm without contagion, food-borne illnesses, viral outbreaks throughout history, the microbiome/gut bacteria, the hygiene hypothesis, immune systems, autoimmune diseases, and the like..." would be answered and you could stop working 20 hours a day on a fools errand.
I work all my waking hours to address the short-comings in your theories and I will continue to do so even though you do not have time to actually read anything I write.
ps
I read your Substack. At least I am prepared to HEAR your views.
There’s nothing wrong with rabbit-holes, Frances—I spend all of my time there! As I previously told you, “Invisible Rainbow” is on my to-read list as are your articles, but I literally have thousands of tabs and books queued up and have to focus on the ones related to my current articles in progress. I appreciate your readership and look forward to learning more when time permits.
I will keep pointing you in the right direction. Promote my work to the top of your list, please. Oh and listen to Purnima Wagh video above. It is brilliant. Surely you can spare 9 mins??
Thanks for your patience with me, Frances :-) I actually listened to part of Purnima's video and found her a compelling source.
And I definitely get that EMF/5G poses a threat to human health. Again, that doesn’t mean viruses/germ/contagion don’t exist, though, and I don’t see how that explains outbreaks like the bubonic plague and other infectious diseases throughout history. And it does not explain how my step-father and numerous other patients contracted hepatitis from a surgeon who failed to clean his instruments between knee surgeries or how our FIV+ cat stopped suffering from upper respiratory infections once we isolated him from the other cats who were carrying but not getting infected because of their stronger immune systems or how my unvaxxed uncle experienced symptoms of COVID after his unvaxxed nurse girlfriend got it after being exposed to it at work. I could come up with a gazillion other examples experienced by myself and others, but I must stop there as I am already getting distracted from what I’m supposed to be working on.
Again, I support your own investigative efforts and encourage people to research this for themselves.
“… astroturfed distraction from stopping totalitarianism and democide and is being used to discredit the Resistance via guilt by association…”
Yes, this. It’s an interesting debate that is similar to the one about the origin of the virus in that it is utterly irrelevant to the actual issue. We are faced with a slide into a totalitarian nightmare society.
Once and if we arrest this slide, have away at the existence or not of viruses. Until then, man the pumps cuz we’re sinking.
How can you be so myopic? If we prove there is no virus then there is no need for vaccines, lockdowns and social distancing. The real causes of illness become evident and surely you are aware that the Great Reset depends on the deployment of 5G and its AI?
Why spend your energy arguing about a fake cause when the real cause of illness is being erected in towers around you all the time?
Not arguing about causes, fake or not, was the entire point.
For the people instituting the totalitarian measures, purported causes are just a convenient hook from which to hang them. You could demonstrate that there is no virus, it wouldn’t matter. You could demonstrate that illnesses are caused by 5G, it wouldn’t matter.
The totalitarian mindset is not at all motivated by harm reduction or any other extraneous motivation. The only goal is total control. Case in point Germany now mandates mask wearing from October to April. No disease necessary anymore.
Therefore we mustn’t concede the point indirectly by arguing about causes. To repeat, causes are just a matter of convenience, not a motivating factor.
If we can prove that there are no viruses, which we have done, btw..... THEN THERE IS NO NEED FOR MASKS EVER AGAIN!
Do not presume that I am unaware of geo-political motives of the Phoenician Black Nobility. I have been warning people about their intentions for 30 years. My
I agree. The evidence for viruses is fairly overwhelming. If nothing else, there's the contagion problem: you need a mechanism to explain the transmission of disease, and germs are the most obvious.
There's a parallel with the No Planers that infested the 9/11 Truth movement after it started to gain traction. Those lunatics generated infighting that wasted energy, while making the movement as a whole look like, well, lunatics. This seems to be a recurring COINTELPRO tactic: develop a model that appeals to the 'question everything' mindset adopted by dissidents and conspiracy theorists, which then diverts attention, discredits the discussion, and squanders energy.
How dare you accuse us of being COINTELPRO agents?? That is super insulting and well below the belt. I could say the very same thing about YOU but that would be beneath me. I have more respect for myself and readers.
There is a perfect explanation for transmission of disease here:
“The evidence for viruses is fairly overwhelming. If nothing else, there's the contagion problem: you need a mechanism to explain the transmission of disease, and germs are the most obvious.”
It’s the least obvious to me. The idea that non-living microorganisms fly through the air from one nasal passage to another, infiltrating their bodily defense system, hijacking our cells and multiplying to cause disease is the most creative fairy tale I’ve ever heard.
Evidence for the phenomenon of the virus and contagion is overwhelming. That doesn’t mean it’s caused by germs. Human bodies are clever things: why wouldn’t sickness in one person trigger sickness in another through other means?
A virus doesn't have to be biological, or have anything to do with "germs". But people definitely seem to be getting infected with something, and contagion seems to be at play: but it is probably occurring more on a metaphysical level. https://downthewombathole.substack.com/p/wetiko-the-virus-and-the-west
At 28:08 she talks about it specifically. Her suggestions are mirror neurons, group fear, herd mentality, morphic resonance, and/or the placebo/nocebo effect.
Her explanation also works on why some people who enter massively "contagious" areas don't get sick. Whereas the germ theory wouldn't explain that very well. At least the terrain theory would a bit too.
911: aluminum tubes don't penetrate steel reinforced cement columns. The 'no planers' were not the lunatics, just as the Covid red-pilled are not the lunatics in denying that the 'jabs' are not in any sense any form of 'vaccine'. It remains important to get to real causation at the bottom of all conspiracy reality.
Virus pushers and deniers are all red-pilled 'no planers' in the 'plandemic' hoax- they are merely arguing about what DID hit the public health towers: a fairly benign flu-like virus, or an environmental toxin. This is an important debate about causation. The problem is that it has been reduced to ad hominem attacks, which are divisive. A good clean debate is not.
4 clarifications for the sake of wider discussion of these issues::
1. Correction on my statement: "" The 'no planers' were not the lunatics, just as the Covid red-pilled are not the lunatics in denying that the 'jabs' are not in any sense any form of 'vaccine'. "" The word 'not', 8th word from the end, should be removed from the sentence, as a double negative is a positive, meaning the red-pilled are approving of the jab, which they are not.
2. The word 'vaccine' is in quotation marks, in this context signifying that the meaning behind the word is the traditional meaning of vaccine as a jab that PREVENTS transmission of infection by stimulating the production of sterilizing antibodies, for example with attenuated virus vaccines. This is the way red-pilled virus-pushers have always understood the word 'vaccine'.
3. Your post jumps over my context in # 2, and interprets the word 'vaccine' solely from the standpoint of a terrain theorist, who obviously does not believe in any virus and therefore correctly assumes, on that premise, that ALL vaccines are mere toxic and harmful jabs. I was not arguing about that, I was including the way red-pilled virus pushers think about traditional sterilizing vaccines.
4. As my post says, the group of red-pilled people who think Covid 19 is a hoax, includes both believers in Germ theory and believers in Terrain theory. In covid hoax theory the term 'red-pilled' has usually meant knowledge of the jabs as a depop/ eugenics agenda, and does not refer to believing in terrain theory over germ theory.
Yeah, starting with the fraudulent notion of "public health." The CONs always lump us together (homogenization, right sir isO?) because they see us as herds of animals to be fenced in and controlled in every way possible.
“If you're gonna keep thinking that questioning something and wanting clear evidence is harassing”
That is the opposite of what I said. As I’ve stated here and elsewhere, I respect those who are inquisitive, reasonable, and willing to agree-to-disagree on non–existential issues like this. I distinguish those from the cultlike ones who are so obsessed with this issue that they make literal threats against me and others simply for not sharing their belief system. I can have civil discussions with those who are rational (like in this thread) as opposed to those who behave like religious fundamentalists. There is nothing to be gained from that kind of vitriol, and it only damages their credibility and position.
It’s such a simple line of inquiry- the fact that it incites such strong reactions makes me think there is something very wrong going on here (in virology and as it pertains to propaganda)
I had no strong feelings about it either way and was open to examining the evidence at a later point when time permitted, but my perspective on it soured after being repeatedly targeted by about a dozen vicious trolls (particularly at the OffGuardian posts of my articles) for simply writing about the efficacy of ivermectin and acknowledging that people are experiencing sickness and even death because of their lack of access to early treatment protocols. I found it bizarre that they were singling me out when I've never written anything about their beliefs and had no opinion on the matter at the time.
Than you Rob, this is my question too, and the reason for the title of this post - the process of determining a virus and viral causality seems unorthodox to say the least (from the perspective of someone outside the field). And the fact that there are serious doubts about viruses even from within virology strikes me as bizarre.
7 labs couldn’t filtrate out a virus, CDC couldn’t come up with anything, no papers claiming to have isolated the virus, and the official genomic sequence is a computer model!???
All I’m asking is “Can someone make sense of this?”
How does this question descend into personal attacks and name calling?
I don’t care if there are viruses or not, but I do care when a gene therapy causes illness and death and it’s blamed on an old, variant or new virus.
Ordinarily, I would have agreed with you that we should not become needlessly distracted from the looming totalitarian threat. I have said as much in other comments on other subjects (and I might well have said this about germ-v-terrain theory in the past). That said, I am a virus-denier. I think it's past time for us to examine other potential causes of illnesses; I believe we have been hijacked by germ theory and big pharma for decades
Also, you could argue that the looming totalitarian threat is in large part predicated on belief in a covid virus that doesn't exist. You could call that the first big lie that started us on the path to dystopia. Where would these tyrants be without an invisible pathogen to scare us? Instead, if we could all realize that we have been lied to from the beginning by proponents of the virus hoax, perhaps more people who are victims of mass hysteria could be persuaded of the fraud that led us to where we are, facing a medical tyranny that depends significantly on the firm belief that a deadly virus (and future deadly viruses) will kill us all unless we accept their "vaccines" and accompanying digital IDs. None of the totalitarian control mechanisms will work without a belief in a deadly virus.
And, for what it's worth, I believe that the level of discourse on this topic, and some others recently, has degenerated to the point where some are more inclined to hurl epithets and insults rather than engage in reasoned debate. If we sink to that level, we won't get very far.
Thank you for your measured and compassionate response, Joe, and you would certainly be one of the individuals I respect who holds these views. I wholeheartedly agree with your closing statement, and that is all I have been asking people to do as we need to be able to have open-minded debates without it degenerating into namecalling (and I do apologize for the use of “denier” in that regard).
I have always left the door open to the possibility that SARS-CoV2 doesn’t exist, which is why I tend to use COVID as a catch-all term for the collection of unique symptoms exhibited by those who come down with it. I agree the threat was magnified beyond all proportions and that it simply should have been treated like another flu, which perhaps it is.
That said, a substantial number of people still suffered from these symptoms and died unnecessarily because they were denied access to early treatment options. They were told to wait until their lips turned blue, at which point they were instructed to go to the hospital to be hospicided by remdesivir and ventilation/intubation.
Tyson and Fareed, Peter McCullough, Pierre Kory, Tess Lawrie, and so many other physicians of integrity witnessed firsthand the miraculous recoveries experienced by patients who were fortunate enough to have access to early treatment protocols. Whatever the root cause, medications like ivermectin addressed it and saved tens of thousands of lives if not hundreds of thousands.
To deny that sickness and death occurred is a non-starter with both Covidians and those who have witnessed the efficacy of early treatment protocols and reviewed the extensive scientific studies demonstrating such. People who are in the thrall of the narrative know *something* got them and others sick and killed others, so saying the virus is a hoax is only going to bring up their defenses. They have a chance of understanding that those people died unnecessarily because of BigPharma’s suppression of early treatment protocols and pushing of murderous hospicidal treatments and dangerous injections, but to say the sickness was nonexistent is not going to jibe with their empirical experience.
This is why I say people virus skeptics are *perceived* (I’m not calling them that myself) as flat-earthers. What is being proposed is *so* far outside normies’ perception of reality (admittedly skewed by propaganda and menticide) that I think such a tact has very little chance of awakening them to the existential threats we need to collectively focus on defeating, namely totalitarianism and democide.
I haven't yet run into anyone who questions the existence of a virus and also denies that lots of people got sick and died. I hope that is not happening. Clearly, many people died unnecessarily because they were denied early treatment. That aspect, to me, is one of the most serious crimes committed by these people.
As an aside, my best friend's wife got caught up in the early stages of this, in April 2020. She was admitted to a hospital on the way home from wintering in Arizona, and her husband was denied access to her for nearly 3 weeks while the hospital treated her and ultimately intubated her to death. I can still hear him crying on the phone about how they both were treated. He was allowed in to her room, in a full body suit, to arrive minutes after she was gone. Sadly, I lost him the following year to liver. disease I miss them both. She tested negative for COVID.
I feel that terrain theory is only a distraction because epithets are being hurled in the direction of terrain. And we're being accused of distracting the main effort to stop the rollout of tyranny. But this itself is tyranny. I'm all for stopping the digital currencies, the cameras every 100 metres and the attempts to build what looks like chicken cages for humans in Saudi Arabia.
And I would have time to do so although like you my time is somewhat limited. But I have direct experience of having insult thrown in my direction that stops such concentrations while you try to attend to the insult. That insult was coming to me from both directions btw but that surprises me zilch. A Lenin quote comes to mind about attending to your opposition by leading it. Playing out now.
But Steve Kirsch is leading the insult brigade at the moment while not attending to the debate suggested to him. Others are joining in, James Lyons-Weiler for example, emails are full of misogynistic insult from the germ brigade to say Christine Massey or (I have yet to see it) Sam Bailey.
Without this insult flying around I suspect that the main focus would be the digital tyranny at the moment, it is for Riley Waggaman for example (slavsquat blog) who has probably avoided the germ/terrain argument.
I would prefer to see a civil dialogue but understand how the insults can start flying out of defensiveness (I have been guilty of that myself when targeted by trolls, I admit). I agree Riley’s doing a good job of highlighting the digital tyranny threats, and we would be wise to heed the harbingers he’s documenting in Russia.
I’ve read a couple of books in Germ vs. Terrain theories and boy, I am even more confused. I think the logical thing to do is to follow the money. Germs=drugs.
Please come to my Substack - I have been writing on similar lines to Dr Purnima Wagh for several years now. I have as much evidence as you could ever need.
There aren't any images of them taken from the fluid of afflicted persons (we're told they need to be "cultured" first, because there "aren't enough to see", even though they say an "infection" *results* from culturing, and that millions are supposedly emitted with each sneeze). The images are all from patient body fluid to which has been added monkey kidney cells and antibiotics which are known to kill kidney cells (not making this up!).
Steve follows the science, meaning the experts that he trusts.
Notice how many of these ppl against convid vaccines are still not acknowledging that mmr, HPV and other vaccines cause issues? McCullough just woke up partially about that.
This is an extremely complicated issue. There are valid points on both sides. It could be a mere toxin, or it could be a virus. Personally, I am not convinced one way or the other. I am keeping an open mind.
If there is a virus and we fail to acknowledge it, it is a medical error of 'omission'. If there is no virus and we falsely promote it, it is an error of 'commission'. So we are walking a thin line and we could fall on either side of the high wire. Bottom-line is that whichever side of the abyss we fall into, the wire was shaken by some higher purposive agent, and the rocks we fall on at the bottom will bring forth a singular higher purpose - our demise.
I think the most we can say, if we are completely honest with ourselves, is that this issue has not been definitively settled.
The one lesson we HAVE learned in this whole 'plandemic' is that so-called 'official Medicine', and 'official Science', and the opinions of 99% of jab-pushing MDs as well as their regulatory agencies and journals, CANNOT to be trusted.
I have an open mind to germs/viruses, but after studying it I don't think it's what we believe. I think somewhere in time people decided they were real and taught others they were real, and now a bunch of people believe they're real and have confirmation bias in a big way.
There are plenty of other views, like the terrain theory.
Here's a German New Medicine standpoint, where she discusses her views on contagion. Her suggestions are mirror neurons, group fear, herd mentality, morphic resonance, and/or the placebo/nocebo effect. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwqtRL9Xc-c&t=1688s
Dr. Melissa Sell wrote this in a telegram post and I think it's a great explanation about how they messed up with germ theory. The short version is people assumed what they found in bodies when people got sick was something attacking the body, when in reality what they found was something helping the body heal akin to a firetruck not starting fires, but being there to clean up after the fire started. Correlation doesn't equal causation.
Stefan Lanka ran the same method with a control, no virus, and with virus.
The results were identical. The antibiotics, antifungals, and other chemicals already cause the same cell death and "virus particles" whether there was a virus or not.
They couldn't even prove transmission with the Spanish flu...
It's rather like you see what used to be a village, with houses smashed and burning, and a bunch of Vikings standing around, surrounded by piles of loot. You ask them, and they profess to have no idea of what just happened... In this case, you get tissue which is undamaged, next to tissue which has suffered damage and there are lots of tiny fuzzy balls hanging around. The logical conclusion is that the fuzzy balls had something to do with the damage, either that they did it themselves, or the SWAT team got called and did the damage for them, and wiping them out in the process.
In the body, there are cells called macrophages - they're the SWAT team, and they destroy cells which produce alien proteins - it's been found through years of research that cells exhibit, on their outside, the proteins that their replicating machinery is producing. The immune system recognizes these proteins as either OK - or Not OK - and in the latter case, shuts down the replication by destroying the machinery (and the cell). The macrophages collect the resultant garbage - in the case of alien proteins and products, such as new virus, which have been tagged with "police tape", otherwise known as antibodies... so if you can detect bits of that "police tape" floating around, you know that something is either happening, or has happened...
Terrain theory dates from back before macrophages were discovered, in the 1880s. People knew something was going on, but had no idea why, and so they created an explanatory theory, to link the effects which were known, and what they surmised were the causes - bad food, bad water, bad air, producing bodies which were susceptible to infection and disease - the "terrain" was favorable for infection to occur. They were in essence flying blind, they did the best that they could at the time, and terrain theory was the result. But scientific knowledge improved and increased, and people were able to detect structures and processes which they could not see before - and that was the end of terrain theory.
But scientific knowledge cheated and poisoned, and people were able to create structures and processes which they could not make before - and that was the fraud of Pasteur's germ theory. There, fixed it for you.
Your reply seriously does not parse - knowledge possesses no volition, and no ability to carry out that volition. Data does not want to be free. Sure, using scientific knowledge, people are able to make structures and processes which were impossible before, but that's the point of applied science. And none of this has anything to do with what you allege is the "fraud" of Pasteur's germ theory. Try writing a logical sentence. There, fixed it for you. I hope you don't apply this same level of analysis to geopolitics. Science is an iterative process, see Kuhn's Structure of Scientific Revolutions for details... At least you call Gonzalo Lira on his game(s), so there's that.
The "tiny fuzzy balls" have never been witnessed in unadulterated fluid taken from a sick individual -- only from samples which have been admixed with monkey kidney cells and antibiotics known to kill kidney cells. Thus, the logical conclusion is actually that the fuzzy balls are a result of that process. A conclusion that Stefan Lanka proved with his control experiments.
I think the no-virus camp is for the most part an expression of a free-wheeling left hemisphere, and in that regard not so different from oldschool skepticism in philosophy which concludes that nothing is real, based on entirely logical and convincing arguments (very intelligent people are often susceptible to the illusions of the logical mind). A few red flags that I see is that many of them are very preachy, get irritated quickly, think they are 100% right while demanding 100% "in your face" proof for the existence of viruses, obsession with "isolation", "purification", "direct causality" and definitions, seem to have a "theory" for everything if you question them, etc. - all modes of thought associated with the left hemisphere.
When faced with such intellectual conundrums, I often find it helpful to go back to personal experience. Here's mine: I had Covid, which I undeniably caught from a meeting with other people (half of them had it too in the next days, exactly the same symptoms), and it had very distinct symptoms, in some ways similar to the flu/cold, but still unlike anything I've had before (and consistent with how Covid symptoms are described). Also, as most of us I guess, I could witness hundreds of PCR and antigen tests being administered in my social circle. And there WAS a clear correlation between those tests and typical Covid symptoms: Many people got tested many times, always negative, then had symptoms, and tested positive. So there's that, which to me suggests that the tests do identify something based on the virus model, DNA sequences etc. (of course, all you need to create a "pandemic" would be a false-positive baseline, plus some meddling with cycles; I'm not at all saying that these tests are without error or can even diagnose a disease).
The way I see it is that virology is plagued by materialist assumptions (like all science) and hence probably misses a lot of nuances and might even be somewhat confused about its own models and methods. However, I think they clearly are onto something, and it's quite fascinating really. It also seems to me that virology and associated fields are tightly controlled (see the case of Judy Mikovitz). There seems to be something very interesting going on at the level of viruses, information exchange, possibly some non-materialist, Sheldrake kind of stuff? What's with all that gain of function research: sure seems some very powerful people are really into virology? Perhaps somebody doesn't want independent researchers to look too closely?
To my way of thinking, the crux of the matter is this:
Even if we accept that viruses/bacteria/parasites cause acute illness -- though Koch's Postulates have never been fulfilled;
And even if we accept that unvaxxxed individuals (whether "symptomatic" or "asymptomatic"), by electing to take an unmasked breath within a six-foot radius of other unmasked and/or unvaxxxed OR vaxxxed and/or masked individuals is "spreading" acute illness -- though person-to-person transmission has been empirically debunked so many times that such experiments were labelled "unethical" and are no longer performed, including with animals;
It's nevertheless incontrovertible that ALL acute illness will resolve without ANY treatment -- other than rest, hydration, fresh air, peace and quiet, and fasting until the appetite returns. In other words, anybody recommending "early treatment", or "alternative treatment", or any other sort of intervention, is a shyster.
The difference between acute and chronic illness is most definitely *not* semantics. The former will pass within a few days when resting, hydrating, and (in the absence of appetite) fasting -- no "treatment" whatsoever is necessary nor recommendable. Indeed, continual suppression of acute symptoms via pharmaceuticals is, in part, the very *cause* of chronic disease.
The body heals itself. ALL drugs are inimical to health.
If you're already so deficient, you'd already be exhibiting the symptoms of chronic deficiency -- which one would expect to be amplified in your scenario. But loss of appetite wouldn't be a symptom in this case. Or if it *were*, I'd personally prefer to listen to my body's signals, and refrain from eating until it returned. I would say that in general drinking fresh juice from ripe fruit would be okay in loss of appetite; though fasting would still be optimal.
Well, let's just say any agent used to suppress symptoms. Though they are of course uncomfortable, that's the price to be paid for the result the symptoms are achieving: Detoxification.
It really doesn't matter, at least not for the moment. Everyone that thinks achieving some sort of consensus on the scientific validity of anything is required to resist tyranny/promote liberty is wrong. THIS belief is the stupid, dangerous belief that we must attack and destroy. We will all believe different things about the nature of the universe and truth. Building an effective coalition to resist a dystopian collapse into neoserfdom requires incorporating people who believe the earth is round and flat, people who think viruses exist and don't, people who believe in God and atheists etc. There is a tendency for freedom loving individuals to think a particular belief is the lynchpin for tyranny that if removed we'll all be free. They get so excited about it, so emotionally invested in sharing the incontrovertible evidence. Guess what? Almost every mainstream belief is completely and totally fucked. If you don't believe me, just find any no-shit expert in any field and ask them what heterodox beliefs they have about their field. They will always have at least a few. The idea that there is just one issue that if we just convince everyone then the lynchpin of tyranny will be removed and we'll all be free is a seductive illusion. If there is such a lynchpin, it is based in philosophy and/or spirituality. Some sort of succinct way to internalize that we don't have to agree about everything to trust one another and build an effective sociopolitical coalition around something simple that we can all agree is mutually beneficial. I think this is the NAP, but whatever it is, it is what we need to be searching for, not arguing about this shit. If we ever do combine our efforts to secure a more or less free society government funding of science disappears then you don't have to worry about other people spending their money researching stupid shit that is a waste of time. In a free society we won't have to worry about public health officials setting draconian policy based on lies, because there won't be public health officials. Someone tell me how I'm wrong. Someone tell me how we all have to agree about the particulars of germ theory in order to be politically successful in achieving our mutually desired end state of a free society.
There is no isolated covid virus and www.awarriorcalls.com is a guy about to confront the Canadian government about it. I am not this guy, but my site is rather www.theredpilloftruth.com
Even if we assume the virus is real, the draconian measures to combat it are surreal. And while the proven absence of a virus would be counterindicative for measures instantly, I fear in our current situation the presence or absence of a virus is rather irrelevant.
Far from irrelevant, it is VITAL that we dispense with Virology because without it all the draconian measures collapse as the bogus control mechanisms that they really are!
https://francesleader.substack.com/p/covid19-symptoms-identical-to-electro?utm_source=substack&utm_campaign=post_embed&utm_medium=web
I admire your belief in fairness.
I get the underlying sneer. However, science can be corrected. If not, we would still be believing in using leeches.
Although I can't deny some sarcasm, it was not meant as a sneer in your direction. I genuinely admire your direction of thought, it's something I have long since fail to muster. I guess I have lost the belief that we are going to resolve all this as gentlemen and -women a long time ago.
Yup!
My point is, you and Frances may very well be right. But that in itself will not be enough. Because "they" have to acknowledge you being right, and they won't do that. Because it's not about the facts, it's about the agenda.
They call the sky green, you call the sky blue. Suppose you can prove the sky is blue, it will bring you nothing if they're still calling it green. They will have to call it blue, because you've proven it, you say? No they don't. And they won't either. So much of what they said about Covid turned out to be blatantly and demonstrably false, but it didn't make one iota of a difference in the end.
So my conclusion is, I admire you for searching out the "Truth", and please do not stop trying. But if you're talking to a brick wall of propaganda, it won't change anything. You can be right, but they have to give your "being right" to you as well.
I personally think this is an astroturfed distraction from stopping totalitarianism and democide and is being used to discredit the Resistance via guilt by association with those perceived to be flat-earthers. That’s not to say there isn’t merit to certain aspects of their arguments (obviously, environmental toxins have had a negative impact on health, but that doesn’t mean germs, viruses, and contagion don’t exist). Some of the virus-deniers are reasonable and willing to agree-to-disagree on this topic, but unfortunately, there is a virulent contingency of particularly hateful and aggressive individuals who are focusing their efforts on attacking the most effective voices in the anti-tyranny movement, and it is creating division at a time when it is far more important for us to unite across superficial differences and academic disagreements.
This article by A Midwestern Doctor offers a deep dive if you have the time (I don’t but have saved it for later reading):
• https://amidwesterndoctor.substack.com/p/thoughts-on-the-existence-of-viruses
Nor me!
So we can agree to stop cursing one another and concentrate on the evidence?
Is that going to work?
Yes, please :-) But I only have so much bandwidth so have to stay focused on defeating totalitarianism and democide, so once that's achieved, I'd be happy to delve further into this topic.
You have been given plenty of evidence that totalitarianism depends on us continuing to believe fake science. Yet you insist that you don't have time to look..... for months you have been saying this. I call you on it.
You'll have to talk to the Germ theory crowd as they're the main ones throwing the insults around. If I watch this;
https://rumble.com/v1dlamj-james-lyons-weiler-everything-youd-want-to-know-about-the-pcr-test.html
It's all insult. There's some circular reasoning and appeal to authority arguments as well, but there's no substance.
On the other hand Mark Bailey here hardly bothers with his detractors and concentrates on the evidence until the cows come home.
https://solluckman.substack.com/p/settling-the-virus-debate-once-and
Shall we therefore try and get Steve et al to attend to the evidence presented by Mark?
I don’t support insult-throwing on either side and feel like this is hurling water balloons at each other while the prison gates are being installed around us. If we fight amongst ourselves, the tyrants win.
“Astroturfed distraction” sounds insulting, as does “virus denier,” a term probably chosen in the Deep State’s psywar labs to sound like “Holocaust denier.”
I do apologize for the use of those terms, Sanjoy, and I mean no disrespect to you or the other reasonable individuals on your side of the debate. Understand that it comes from having been aggressively attacked and threatened on a variety of platforms by the fundamentalist fringe of this contingency, and it is they who are doing the greatest damage to your arguments as well as to the overall resistance. I have no problems with respectful dialogue on this matter but simply ask that those of us who are focusing every ounce of our strength on defeating tyranny and ending democide be permitted to continue doing so without being subjected to ankle-biting on a matter that can be better discussed calmly after the conflagration is extinguished.
Thank you, apology accepted. I am not in favor of ankle biting. But postponing even calm discussions of these questions is a step too far, as I don’t see how the conflagration can be extinguished without taking away the lighter fluid of deadly viruses on the march.
With all due respect, my 1st introduction to terrain theory came bundled with an insult, followed by apparent stalking.
I have never disputed the merits of terrain theory. I have, however, benefitted from antibiotics, both externally on infected cuts and internally when my dentist saved my life.
They are not mutually exclusive theories, although each, in and of itself, is incomplete & likely contains errors.
Beyond that, I'm sick to death the sideshow & agree with MAA above.
Antibiotics deal to bacteria rather than viruses. I'm not exactly sure how they do that and figure that might be an interesting diversion at some stage. The picture in Winston's post looks like bacteria to me. But then it looks kind of fake as well with all those colours.
"I'm not exactly sure how they do that"
Antibiotics target various metabolic pathways of bacteria. Eg, penicillin class targets the peptidoglycan layer of the cell wall, preventing repair/replacement.
The colors are likely added or highlighted
to differentiate structures, materials, etc. Since viruses don't have their own metabolism, antobiotics aren't effective against them.
Viruses are much smaller than bacteria. Eg, the tb mycobacterium is some 500X the size of the sarscov virion.
Bacteria are ubiquitous in the environment.
I don't believe in viruses and the main reason is the outrageous claims that I saw made on germs in the 'Spanish flu" "outbreak" of 1918 and 1919 (and sometimes these germs were described as bacterium). It gave me the clarity to realize that we once again were being subjected to complete bollocks. Stefan Lanka also helped. As did old 1950s books on the topic. I guess others went through a similar process. The anti-vaxxers (it's a derogatory term of course) seem to have been right all along. That our governments can be so malicious towards their citizens a wake up call for those of us born after WW2 in the West.
So my view is that the so called viruses which as you say above, more or less, are completely dead are just such things as exosomes or maybe just discarded cell material. None, as we all know by now, have been isolated. The process for finding them is both physically destructive and digitally manipulative of late (i.e. they exist only on a computer).
If we bring down Virology all the mess collapses. Everything hinges on us achieving the end of bogus Rockefeller allopathy. We should unite over THAT, Margaret, rather than pussy-foot around the peripherals.
https://francesleader.substack.com/p/covid19-symptoms-identical-to-electro?utm_source=substack&utm_campaign=post_embed&utm_medium=web
I’m all for taking down Rockefeller allopathy and have touched on that in previous articles, but that is a longer-term goal that cannot be achieved if we are frog-marched into a digital biosurveillance prison. This is why I’ve said that it is more important to stop totalitiarianism than even democide—once the digital handcuffs are on, there will be no escape and no opportunity to address the other issues.
We need the public to awaken in a massive way, and you are not going to get the middle 40% swing thinkers to look twice with this approach as it contradicts everything in their empirical and epistemological knowledge base. I have a few thousand questions that cannot be answered in a paradigm without contagion, food-borne illnesses, viral outbreaks throughout history, the microbiome/gut bacteria, the hygiene hypothesis, immune systems, autoimmune diseases, and the like, and I am already working 20-hour days and am desperately behind on what I am already committed to and cannot waste months if not years going down a rabbit-hole that looks like a dead end to start with.
I understand you are far further down that rabbit-hole and feel it has merit, so great. You are far better-equipped to address these issues than I am. There are people I respect who hold different beliefs on this matter, and I fully support their efforts to expose lies and corruption.
Associating me with 'rabbit holes' and stating that there are people you respect tells me your opinion about me and my in-depth research. If you were to read just one book, The Invisible Rainbow by Arthur Firstenberg, the 'few thousand questions that cannot be answered in a paradigm without contagion, food-borne illnesses, viral outbreaks throughout history, the microbiome/gut bacteria, the hygiene hypothesis, immune systems, autoimmune diseases, and the like..." would be answered and you could stop working 20 hours a day on a fools errand.
I work all my waking hours to address the short-comings in your theories and I will continue to do so even though you do not have time to actually read anything I write.
ps
I read your Substack. At least I am prepared to HEAR your views.
There’s nothing wrong with rabbit-holes, Frances—I spend all of my time there! As I previously told you, “Invisible Rainbow” is on my to-read list as are your articles, but I literally have thousands of tabs and books queued up and have to focus on the ones related to my current articles in progress. I appreciate your readership and look forward to learning more when time permits.
I will keep pointing you in the right direction. Promote my work to the top of your list, please. Oh and listen to Purnima Wagh video above. It is brilliant. Surely you can spare 9 mins??
Thanks for your patience with me, Frances :-) I actually listened to part of Purnima's video and found her a compelling source.
And I definitely get that EMF/5G poses a threat to human health. Again, that doesn’t mean viruses/germ/contagion don’t exist, though, and I don’t see how that explains outbreaks like the bubonic plague and other infectious diseases throughout history. And it does not explain how my step-father and numerous other patients contracted hepatitis from a surgeon who failed to clean his instruments between knee surgeries or how our FIV+ cat stopped suffering from upper respiratory infections once we isolated him from the other cats who were carrying but not getting infected because of their stronger immune systems or how my unvaxxed uncle experienced symptoms of COVID after his unvaxxed nurse girlfriend got it after being exposed to it at work. I could come up with a gazillion other examples experienced by myself and others, but I must stop there as I am already getting distracted from what I’m supposed to be working on.
Again, I support your own investigative efforts and encourage people to research this for themselves.
“… astroturfed distraction from stopping totalitarianism and democide and is being used to discredit the Resistance via guilt by association…”
Yes, this. It’s an interesting debate that is similar to the one about the origin of the virus in that it is utterly irrelevant to the actual issue. We are faced with a slide into a totalitarian nightmare society.
Once and if we arrest this slide, have away at the existence or not of viruses. Until then, man the pumps cuz we’re sinking.
How can you be so myopic? If we prove there is no virus then there is no need for vaccines, lockdowns and social distancing. The real causes of illness become evident and surely you are aware that the Great Reset depends on the deployment of 5G and its AI?
Why spend your energy arguing about a fake cause when the real cause of illness is being erected in towers around you all the time?
Not arguing about causes, fake or not, was the entire point.
For the people instituting the totalitarian measures, purported causes are just a convenient hook from which to hang them. You could demonstrate that there is no virus, it wouldn’t matter. You could demonstrate that illnesses are caused by 5G, it wouldn’t matter.
The totalitarian mindset is not at all motivated by harm reduction or any other extraneous motivation. The only goal is total control. Case in point Germany now mandates mask wearing from October to April. No disease necessary anymore.
Therefore we mustn’t concede the point indirectly by arguing about causes. To repeat, causes are just a matter of convenience, not a motivating factor.
If we can prove that there are no viruses, which we have done, btw..... THEN THERE IS NO NEED FOR MASKS EVER AGAIN!
Do not presume that I am unaware of geo-political motives of the Phoenician Black Nobility. I have been warning people about their intentions for 30 years. My
most recent update is here:
https://francesleader.substack.com/p/who-rules-the-world?utm_source=%2Fsaved&utm_medium=reader2
I agree. The evidence for viruses is fairly overwhelming. If nothing else, there's the contagion problem: you need a mechanism to explain the transmission of disease, and germs are the most obvious.
There's a parallel with the No Planers that infested the 9/11 Truth movement after it started to gain traction. Those lunatics generated infighting that wasted energy, while making the movement as a whole look like, well, lunatics. This seems to be a recurring COINTELPRO tactic: develop a model that appeals to the 'question everything' mindset adopted by dissidents and conspiracy theorists, which then diverts attention, discredits the discussion, and squanders energy.
How dare you accuse us of being COINTELPRO agents?? That is super insulting and well below the belt. I could say the very same thing about YOU but that would be beneath me. I have more respect for myself and readers.
There is a perfect explanation for transmission of disease here:
https://www.bitchute.com/video/3o4ROPOv4v6q/
Bingo. Projecting blame on those opposing the fraud is *essential* in the CONs' playbook.
“The evidence for viruses is fairly overwhelming. If nothing else, there's the contagion problem: you need a mechanism to explain the transmission of disease, and germs are the most obvious.”
It’s the least obvious to me. The idea that non-living microorganisms fly through the air from one nasal passage to another, infiltrating their bodily defense system, hijacking our cells and multiplying to cause disease is the most creative fairy tale I’ve ever heard.
Evidence for the phenomenon of the virus and contagion is overwhelming. That doesn’t mean it’s caused by germs. Human bodies are clever things: why wouldn’t sickness in one person trigger sickness in another through other means?
A virus doesn't have to be biological, or have anything to do with "germs". But people definitely seem to be getting infected with something, and contagion seems to be at play: but it is probably occurring more on a metaphysical level. https://downthewombathole.substack.com/p/wetiko-the-virus-and-the-west
Suggested reading re contagion:
https://sebastienpowell.substack.com/p/on-infectious-diseases-and-contagion?r=3su9x&utm_medium=ios
And the planes were probably holograms. Soz
Or CGI added to videos.
Yes, absolutely, holograms or CGI
You got it!
There's a video from someone who practices German New Medicine and she discusses her beliefs about contagions here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwqtRL9Xc-c&t=1688s
At 28:08 she talks about it specifically. Her suggestions are mirror neurons, group fear, herd mentality, morphic resonance, and/or the placebo/nocebo effect.
Her explanation also works on why some people who enter massively "contagious" areas don't get sick. Whereas the germ theory wouldn't explain that very well. At least the terrain theory would a bit too.
Excellent presentation. Thank you!
You're welcome.
Yup. I’m in this crowd.
That's a great video, thanks for sharing 💜
You're welcome. Glad you enjoyed it. 💜
Thanks will have a look.
John,
911: aluminum tubes don't penetrate steel reinforced cement columns. The 'no planers' were not the lunatics, just as the Covid red-pilled are not the lunatics in denying that the 'jabs' are not in any sense any form of 'vaccine'. It remains important to get to real causation at the bottom of all conspiracy reality.
Virus pushers and deniers are all red-pilled 'no planers' in the 'plandemic' hoax- they are merely arguing about what DID hit the public health towers: a fairly benign flu-like virus, or an environmental toxin. This is an important debate about causation. The problem is that it has been reduced to ad hominem attacks, which are divisive. A good clean debate is not.
4 clarifications for the sake of wider discussion of these issues::
1. Correction on my statement: "" The 'no planers' were not the lunatics, just as the Covid red-pilled are not the lunatics in denying that the 'jabs' are not in any sense any form of 'vaccine'. "" The word 'not', 8th word from the end, should be removed from the sentence, as a double negative is a positive, meaning the red-pilled are approving of the jab, which they are not.
2. The word 'vaccine' is in quotation marks, in this context signifying that the meaning behind the word is the traditional meaning of vaccine as a jab that PREVENTS transmission of infection by stimulating the production of sterilizing antibodies, for example with attenuated virus vaccines. This is the way red-pilled virus-pushers have always understood the word 'vaccine'.
3. Your post jumps over my context in # 2, and interprets the word 'vaccine' solely from the standpoint of a terrain theorist, who obviously does not believe in any virus and therefore correctly assumes, on that premise, that ALL vaccines are mere toxic and harmful jabs. I was not arguing about that, I was including the way red-pilled virus pushers think about traditional sterilizing vaccines.
4. As my post says, the group of red-pilled people who think Covid 19 is a hoax, includes both believers in Germ theory and believers in Terrain theory. In covid hoax theory the term 'red-pilled' has usually meant knowledge of the jabs as a depop/ eugenics agenda, and does not refer to believing in terrain theory over germ theory.
Originally what hit the public health towers was a fraud.
Yeah, starting with the fraudulent notion of "public health." The CONs always lump us together (homogenization, right sir isO?) because they see us as herds of animals to be fenced in and controlled in every way possible.
What’s wrong with flat earthers?
Calling them deniers is insulting and a page out of the mainstream narrative.
They just want to have more clarification on the methods used to claim viruses caused this or that disease.
Here's an example of Spanish flu studies that couldn't prove transmission at all...
https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/67902
If you're gonna keep thinking that questioning something and wanting clear evidence is harassing, while calling them deniers, you will get push back.
And how can you fight tyranny when they keep bringing up more and more bullshit viruses, like monkeypox to keep people afraid?
Parasite stress theory, keep people afraid of something that can hurt them and they won't think whether it's real or not.
Point taken re: the “deniers” verbiage.
“If you're gonna keep thinking that questioning something and wanting clear evidence is harassing”
That is the opposite of what I said. As I’ve stated here and elsewhere, I respect those who are inquisitive, reasonable, and willing to agree-to-disagree on non–existential issues like this. I distinguish those from the cultlike ones who are so obsessed with this issue that they make literal threats against me and others simply for not sharing their belief system. I can have civil discussions with those who are rational (like in this thread) as opposed to those who behave like religious fundamentalists. There is nothing to be gained from that kind of vitriol, and it only damages their credibility and position.
There are a huge number of Germ Theory and virus believers who behave like religious fundamentalists. I know this because they abuse me every day!
Again, why does such a basic line of inquiry polarize us so?
Because it is dangerous to the entire fraud.
It’s such a simple line of inquiry- the fact that it incites such strong reactions makes me think there is something very wrong going on here (in virology and as it pertains to propaganda)
I had no strong feelings about it either way and was open to examining the evidence at a later point when time permitted, but my perspective on it soured after being repeatedly targeted by about a dozen vicious trolls (particularly at the OffGuardian posts of my articles) for simply writing about the efficacy of ivermectin and acknowledging that people are experiencing sickness and even death because of their lack of access to early treatment protocols. I found it bizarre that they were singling me out when I've never written anything about their beliefs and had no opinion on the matter at the time.
Than you Rob, this is my question too, and the reason for the title of this post - the process of determining a virus and viral causality seems unorthodox to say the least (from the perspective of someone outside the field). And the fact that there are serious doubts about viruses even from within virology strikes me as bizarre.
7 labs couldn’t filtrate out a virus, CDC couldn’t come up with anything, no papers claiming to have isolated the virus, and the official genomic sequence is a computer model!???
All I’m asking is “Can someone make sense of this?”
How does this question descend into personal attacks and name calling?
I don’t care if there are viruses or not, but I do care when a gene therapy causes illness and death and it’s blamed on an old, variant or new virus.
Hi Margaret Anna. I hope you're still doing well.
Ordinarily, I would have agreed with you that we should not become needlessly distracted from the looming totalitarian threat. I have said as much in other comments on other subjects (and I might well have said this about germ-v-terrain theory in the past). That said, I am a virus-denier. I think it's past time for us to examine other potential causes of illnesses; I believe we have been hijacked by germ theory and big pharma for decades
Also, you could argue that the looming totalitarian threat is in large part predicated on belief in a covid virus that doesn't exist. You could call that the first big lie that started us on the path to dystopia. Where would these tyrants be without an invisible pathogen to scare us? Instead, if we could all realize that we have been lied to from the beginning by proponents of the virus hoax, perhaps more people who are victims of mass hysteria could be persuaded of the fraud that led us to where we are, facing a medical tyranny that depends significantly on the firm belief that a deadly virus (and future deadly viruses) will kill us all unless we accept their "vaccines" and accompanying digital IDs. None of the totalitarian control mechanisms will work without a belief in a deadly virus.
And, for what it's worth, I believe that the level of discourse on this topic, and some others recently, has degenerated to the point where some are more inclined to hurl epithets and insults rather than engage in reasoned debate. If we sink to that level, we won't get very far.
Thank you for your measured and compassionate response, Joe, and you would certainly be one of the individuals I respect who holds these views. I wholeheartedly agree with your closing statement, and that is all I have been asking people to do as we need to be able to have open-minded debates without it degenerating into namecalling (and I do apologize for the use of “denier” in that regard).
I have always left the door open to the possibility that SARS-CoV2 doesn’t exist, which is why I tend to use COVID as a catch-all term for the collection of unique symptoms exhibited by those who come down with it. I agree the threat was magnified beyond all proportions and that it simply should have been treated like another flu, which perhaps it is.
That said, a substantial number of people still suffered from these symptoms and died unnecessarily because they were denied access to early treatment options. They were told to wait until their lips turned blue, at which point they were instructed to go to the hospital to be hospicided by remdesivir and ventilation/intubation.
Tyson and Fareed, Peter McCullough, Pierre Kory, Tess Lawrie, and so many other physicians of integrity witnessed firsthand the miraculous recoveries experienced by patients who were fortunate enough to have access to early treatment protocols. Whatever the root cause, medications like ivermectin addressed it and saved tens of thousands of lives if not hundreds of thousands.
To deny that sickness and death occurred is a non-starter with both Covidians and those who have witnessed the efficacy of early treatment protocols and reviewed the extensive scientific studies demonstrating such. People who are in the thrall of the narrative know *something* got them and others sick and killed others, so saying the virus is a hoax is only going to bring up their defenses. They have a chance of understanding that those people died unnecessarily because of BigPharma’s suppression of early treatment protocols and pushing of murderous hospicidal treatments and dangerous injections, but to say the sickness was nonexistent is not going to jibe with their empirical experience.
This is why I say people virus skeptics are *perceived* (I’m not calling them that myself) as flat-earthers. What is being proposed is *so* far outside normies’ perception of reality (admittedly skewed by propaganda and menticide) that I think such a tact has very little chance of awakening them to the existential threats we need to collectively focus on defeating, namely totalitarianism and democide.
I haven't yet run into anyone who questions the existence of a virus and also denies that lots of people got sick and died. I hope that is not happening. Clearly, many people died unnecessarily because they were denied early treatment. That aspect, to me, is one of the most serious crimes committed by these people.
As an aside, my best friend's wife got caught up in the early stages of this, in April 2020. She was admitted to a hospital on the way home from wintering in Arizona, and her husband was denied access to her for nearly 3 weeks while the hospital treated her and ultimately intubated her to death. I can still hear him crying on the phone about how they both were treated. He was allowed in to her room, in a full body suit, to arrive minutes after she was gone. Sadly, I lost him the following year to liver. disease I miss them both. She tested negative for COVID.
Take care, Margaret Anna.
So sorry, Joe 😭💔🤗
I feel that terrain theory is only a distraction because epithets are being hurled in the direction of terrain. And we're being accused of distracting the main effort to stop the rollout of tyranny. But this itself is tyranny. I'm all for stopping the digital currencies, the cameras every 100 metres and the attempts to build what looks like chicken cages for humans in Saudi Arabia.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300648501/the-line-a-grand-vision-of-the-future-or-a-petroldollar-fantasy
And I would have time to do so although like you my time is somewhat limited. But I have direct experience of having insult thrown in my direction that stops such concentrations while you try to attend to the insult. That insult was coming to me from both directions btw but that surprises me zilch. A Lenin quote comes to mind about attending to your opposition by leading it. Playing out now.
But Steve Kirsch is leading the insult brigade at the moment while not attending to the debate suggested to him. Others are joining in, James Lyons-Weiler for example, emails are full of misogynistic insult from the germ brigade to say Christine Massey or (I have yet to see it) Sam Bailey.
Without this insult flying around I suspect that the main focus would be the digital tyranny at the moment, it is for Riley Waggaman for example (slavsquat blog) who has probably avoided the germ/terrain argument.
I would prefer to see a civil dialogue but understand how the insults can start flying out of defensiveness (I have been guilty of that myself when targeted by trolls, I admit). I agree Riley’s doing a good job of highlighting the digital tyranny threats, and we would be wise to heed the harbingers he’s documenting in Russia.
It’s one of his worst argued articles, filled with straw men and gaslighting.
Picture looks like bacteria.
For example look here. Also they give the impression of being computer generated images. They're definitely coloured.
https://www.canstockphoto.com/illustration/meningitis.html
Yes the image would be colored in something like photoshop as the microscopy would be in black and white.
I’ve read a couple of books in Germ vs. Terrain theories and boy, I am even more confused. I think the logical thing to do is to follow the money. Germs=drugs.
Please come to my Substack - I have been writing on similar lines to Dr Purnima Wagh for several years now. I have as much evidence as you could ever need.
For example:
https://francesleader.substack.com/p/all-my-substack-articles-on-emfc19
Yes I will and thanks for your engagement on this post.
It's realy very simple; NOT ONE "virus" has ever been isolated and purified, which means they don't exist Virology is fake science.
This is what bemused me - so we can take electron microscope pictures of them but we can’t actually “isolate” them?
There aren't any images of them taken from the fluid of afflicted persons (we're told they need to be "cultured" first, because there "aren't enough to see", even though they say an "infection" *results* from culturing, and that millions are supposedly emitted with each sneeze). The images are all from patient body fluid to which has been added monkey kidney cells and antibiotics which are known to kill kidney cells (not making this up!).
https://stevekirsch.substack.com/p/is-there-a-virus-round-1?utm_source=%2Fprofile%2F40661664-steve-kirsch&utm_medium=reader2
Steve Kirsch articles:
https://stevekirsch.substack.com/p/sam-baileys-very-disingenuous-settling?utm_source=%2Fprofile%2F40661664-steve-kirsch&utm_medium=reader2
https://stevekirsch.substack.com/p/settling-the-virus-debate-challenge?utm_source=%2Fprofile%2F40661664-steve-kirsch&utm_medium=reader2
https://stevekirsch.substack.com/p/does-anyone-want-to-debate-does-the?utm_source=%2Fprofile%2F40661664-steve-kirsch&utm_medium=reader2
Marc Mullie MD
Montreal
Steve Kirsch has been challenged to debate Tom Cowan and Andy Kaufman recently. He is ignoring them.
I have challenged him and his response was very rude.
https://francesleader.substack.com/p/there-is-no-virus
Steve follows the science, meaning the experts that he trusts.
Notice how many of these ppl against convid vaccines are still not acknowledging that mmr, HPV and other vaccines cause issues? McCullough just woke up partially about that.
https://viroliegy.com/2022/07/15/the-no-virus-challenge/
Thanks Marc - I haven’t caught up with Kirsch’s substack in a while - will check it out.
This is an extremely complicated issue. There are valid points on both sides. It could be a mere toxin, or it could be a virus. Personally, I am not convinced one way or the other. I am keeping an open mind.
If there is a virus and we fail to acknowledge it, it is a medical error of 'omission'. If there is no virus and we falsely promote it, it is an error of 'commission'. So we are walking a thin line and we could fall on either side of the high wire. Bottom-line is that whichever side of the abyss we fall into, the wire was shaken by some higher purposive agent, and the rocks we fall on at the bottom will bring forth a singular higher purpose - our demise.
I think the most we can say, if we are completely honest with ourselves, is that this issue has not been definitively settled.
The one lesson we HAVE learned in this whole 'plandemic' is that so-called 'official Medicine', and 'official Science', and the opinions of 99% of jab-pushing MDs as well as their regulatory agencies and journals, CANNOT to be trusted.
Marc Mullie MD
Montreal
I have an open mind to germs/viruses, but after studying it I don't think it's what we believe. I think somewhere in time people decided they were real and taught others they were real, and now a bunch of people believe they're real and have confirmation bias in a big way.
There are plenty of other views, like the terrain theory.
I made a video about how people get sick from a law of attraction standpoint here: https://youtu.be/X3ERj7yjkwg
Here's a German New Medicine standpoint, where she discusses her views on contagion. Her suggestions are mirror neurons, group fear, herd mentality, morphic resonance, and/or the placebo/nocebo effect. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwqtRL9Xc-c&t=1688s
Dr. Melissa Sell wrote this in a telegram post and I think it's a great explanation about how they messed up with germ theory. The short version is people assumed what they found in bodies when people got sick was something attacking the body, when in reality what they found was something helping the body heal akin to a firetruck not starting fires, but being there to clean up after the fire started. Correlation doesn't equal causation.
https://hackingyourlife.locals.com/post/2101972/re-thinking-germ-theory
The issue is with their isolation methods.
Stefan Lanka ran the same method with a control, no virus, and with virus.
The results were identical. The antibiotics, antifungals, and other chemicals already cause the same cell death and "virus particles" whether there was a virus or not.
They couldn't even prove transmission with the Spanish flu...
https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/67902
All vaccines are useless, coming out after drastic drops
Polio for example was from pesticides, smallpox from sanitation issues.
But you can't sue a virus...
https://learntherisk.org/vaccines/diseases/
Dr Sam Bailey on odysee is great.
So are these websites
https://viroliegy.com/
https://northerntracey213875959.wordpress.com/
Thanks Rob I’ll check out some of those links.
Hadn't seen this before. Thanks for sharing, Winston. Will be linking today @https://nothingnewunderthesun2016.com/
Let us examine the middle ground which bears the most probability of what actually happened.
A decision to rebrand Influenza A or B and attribute otherwise all cause mortality to a novel coronavirus.
At the same time the Chinese CDC announced the discovery of a novel coronavirus that deemed reaponsible for the all cause mortality.
Driven by government and media panic sets in causing mass psychosis..
The rest is history.
This satisfies both terrain and germ theories
It's rather like you see what used to be a village, with houses smashed and burning, and a bunch of Vikings standing around, surrounded by piles of loot. You ask them, and they profess to have no idea of what just happened... In this case, you get tissue which is undamaged, next to tissue which has suffered damage and there are lots of tiny fuzzy balls hanging around. The logical conclusion is that the fuzzy balls had something to do with the damage, either that they did it themselves, or the SWAT team got called and did the damage for them, and wiping them out in the process.
In the body, there are cells called macrophages - they're the SWAT team, and they destroy cells which produce alien proteins - it's been found through years of research that cells exhibit, on their outside, the proteins that their replicating machinery is producing. The immune system recognizes these proteins as either OK - or Not OK - and in the latter case, shuts down the replication by destroying the machinery (and the cell). The macrophages collect the resultant garbage - in the case of alien proteins and products, such as new virus, which have been tagged with "police tape", otherwise known as antibodies... so if you can detect bits of that "police tape" floating around, you know that something is either happening, or has happened...
Terrain theory dates from back before macrophages were discovered, in the 1880s. People knew something was going on, but had no idea why, and so they created an explanatory theory, to link the effects which were known, and what they surmised were the causes - bad food, bad water, bad air, producing bodies which were susceptible to infection and disease - the "terrain" was favorable for infection to occur. They were in essence flying blind, they did the best that they could at the time, and terrain theory was the result. But scientific knowledge improved and increased, and people were able to detect structures and processes which they could not see before - and that was the end of terrain theory.
But scientific knowledge cheated and poisoned, and people were able to create structures and processes which they could not make before - and that was the fraud of Pasteur's germ theory. There, fixed it for you.
Your reply seriously does not parse - knowledge possesses no volition, and no ability to carry out that volition. Data does not want to be free. Sure, using scientific knowledge, people are able to make structures and processes which were impossible before, but that's the point of applied science. And none of this has anything to do with what you allege is the "fraud" of Pasteur's germ theory. Try writing a logical sentence. There, fixed it for you. I hope you don't apply this same level of analysis to geopolitics. Science is an iterative process, see Kuhn's Structure of Scientific Revolutions for details... At least you call Gonzalo Lira on his game(s), so there's that.
Bitchcraft is not your greatest skill, is it?
Logic and reason obviously aren't yours.
More bitchcraft? You are on a roll.....
The "tiny fuzzy balls" have never been witnessed in unadulterated fluid taken from a sick individual -- only from samples which have been admixed with monkey kidney cells and antibiotics known to kill kidney cells. Thus, the logical conclusion is actually that the fuzzy balls are a result of that process. A conclusion that Stefan Lanka proved with his control experiments.
I think the no-virus camp is for the most part an expression of a free-wheeling left hemisphere, and in that regard not so different from oldschool skepticism in philosophy which concludes that nothing is real, based on entirely logical and convincing arguments (very intelligent people are often susceptible to the illusions of the logical mind). A few red flags that I see is that many of them are very preachy, get irritated quickly, think they are 100% right while demanding 100% "in your face" proof for the existence of viruses, obsession with "isolation", "purification", "direct causality" and definitions, seem to have a "theory" for everything if you question them, etc. - all modes of thought associated with the left hemisphere.
When faced with such intellectual conundrums, I often find it helpful to go back to personal experience. Here's mine: I had Covid, which I undeniably caught from a meeting with other people (half of them had it too in the next days, exactly the same symptoms), and it had very distinct symptoms, in some ways similar to the flu/cold, but still unlike anything I've had before (and consistent with how Covid symptoms are described). Also, as most of us I guess, I could witness hundreds of PCR and antigen tests being administered in my social circle. And there WAS a clear correlation between those tests and typical Covid symptoms: Many people got tested many times, always negative, then had symptoms, and tested positive. So there's that, which to me suggests that the tests do identify something based on the virus model, DNA sequences etc. (of course, all you need to create a "pandemic" would be a false-positive baseline, plus some meddling with cycles; I'm not at all saying that these tests are without error or can even diagnose a disease).
The way I see it is that virology is plagued by materialist assumptions (like all science) and hence probably misses a lot of nuances and might even be somewhat confused about its own models and methods. However, I think they clearly are onto something, and it's quite fascinating really. It also seems to me that virology and associated fields are tightly controlled (see the case of Judy Mikovitz). There seems to be something very interesting going on at the level of viruses, information exchange, possibly some non-materialist, Sheldrake kind of stuff? What's with all that gain of function research: sure seems some very powerful people are really into virology? Perhaps somebody doesn't want independent researchers to look too closely?
To my way of thinking, the crux of the matter is this:
Even if we accept that viruses/bacteria/parasites cause acute illness -- though Koch's Postulates have never been fulfilled;
And even if we accept that unvaxxxed individuals (whether "symptomatic" or "asymptomatic"), by electing to take an unmasked breath within a six-foot radius of other unmasked and/or unvaxxxed OR vaxxxed and/or masked individuals is "spreading" acute illness -- though person-to-person transmission has been empirically debunked so many times that such experiments were labelled "unethical" and are no longer performed, including with animals;
It's nevertheless incontrovertible that ALL acute illness will resolve without ANY treatment -- other than rest, hydration, fresh air, peace and quiet, and fasting until the appetite returns. In other words, anybody recommending "early treatment", or "alternative treatment", or any other sort of intervention, is a shyster.
THE BODY HEALS ITSELF.
I would call that a chronic issue, not an acute illness.
The difference between acute and chronic illness is most definitely *not* semantics. The former will pass within a few days when resting, hydrating, and (in the absence of appetite) fasting -- no "treatment" whatsoever is necessary nor recommendable. Indeed, continual suppression of acute symptoms via pharmaceuticals is, in part, the very *cause* of chronic disease.
The body heals itself. ALL drugs are inimical to health.
If you're already so deficient, you'd already be exhibiting the symptoms of chronic deficiency -- which one would expect to be amplified in your scenario. But loss of appetite wouldn't be a symptom in this case. Or if it *were*, I'd personally prefer to listen to my body's signals, and refrain from eating until it returned. I would say that in general drinking fresh juice from ripe fruit would be okay in loss of appetite; though fasting would still be optimal.
Well, let's just say any agent used to suppress symptoms. Though they are of course uncomfortable, that's the price to be paid for the result the symptoms are achieving: Detoxification.
It really doesn't matter, at least not for the moment. Everyone that thinks achieving some sort of consensus on the scientific validity of anything is required to resist tyranny/promote liberty is wrong. THIS belief is the stupid, dangerous belief that we must attack and destroy. We will all believe different things about the nature of the universe and truth. Building an effective coalition to resist a dystopian collapse into neoserfdom requires incorporating people who believe the earth is round and flat, people who think viruses exist and don't, people who believe in God and atheists etc. There is a tendency for freedom loving individuals to think a particular belief is the lynchpin for tyranny that if removed we'll all be free. They get so excited about it, so emotionally invested in sharing the incontrovertible evidence. Guess what? Almost every mainstream belief is completely and totally fucked. If you don't believe me, just find any no-shit expert in any field and ask them what heterodox beliefs they have about their field. They will always have at least a few. The idea that there is just one issue that if we just convince everyone then the lynchpin of tyranny will be removed and we'll all be free is a seductive illusion. If there is such a lynchpin, it is based in philosophy and/or spirituality. Some sort of succinct way to internalize that we don't have to agree about everything to trust one another and build an effective sociopolitical coalition around something simple that we can all agree is mutually beneficial. I think this is the NAP, but whatever it is, it is what we need to be searching for, not arguing about this shit. If we ever do combine our efforts to secure a more or less free society government funding of science disappears then you don't have to worry about other people spending their money researching stupid shit that is a waste of time. In a free society we won't have to worry about public health officials setting draconian policy based on lies, because there won't be public health officials. Someone tell me how I'm wrong. Someone tell me how we all have to agree about the particulars of germ theory in order to be politically successful in achieving our mutually desired end state of a free society.
I don't know what you mean by terrain theory.
There is no isolated covid virus and www.awarriorcalls.com is a guy about to confront the Canadian government about it. I am not this guy, but my site is rather www.theredpilloftruth.com